Pontiac heads besides Edelbrock

[Joe Mendelis]

What's all this noise.

My standard King Street 455:
240's @ .050 hyd roller
4.21 stroke
6.625 rod
10.4 Cr.
91 octane
600 lbs. ft. at 4000 rpm
621 hp at 5400 hp.
87 cc Edelbrock heads - my work.
RPM intake.
850 Speed Demon
No shaft rockers. No high ports.
You can do it.
www.PontiacEngines.com

No offense, but the Dyno numbers sound a little off. I have seen the Edelbrock Pontiac head. It is "of poor design" to try to say it with respect.
1.3 ft/lb per inch out of that head would be good. Especially to make more peak torque at peak power than at peak torque. (over 600 ft lb at peak power). Did you dyno it yourself? Does the torque just completely flat line from 4000 to 5400?

I have never used, or worked on a set of the KRE heads, but if I was forced to build a Pontiac I would surely use KRE over Edelbrock for power.
I just can't imagine why they would still use that flat, horrible chamber like the stock head, then put seats in that are way too big for the valve so you have a giant flat shelf. You could always sink the valvejob .200 and make it come in.

[ClassKing]

This is not "one" engine. I've built literally close to a hundred of these 455's. You may want to pruse my site to see the dyno sheets. The torque is a wonderful long flat line. Many end up around the very high 580/590 in hp, two were well past 600 at 5400 rpm and all were 590/610 torque at 4000/4100 rpm. If you think that's unbelievable you'll probably have a real hard time with the 350 Pontiac I built for a Car Craft story. It was 9.5 Cr. 87 octane. 750 Speed Demon. 540 hp. The dyno sheet is on the site, along with ET slips. I don't live by dyno numbers, but they're something to look at. All of these pulls were made at Westech. Runs were made all over the country. What you don't want to do is doubt these results. But rather learn how to duplicate the results.

[Joe Mendelis]

What you don't want to do is doubt these results. But rather learn how to duplicate the results.

Sorry, I will try to start learning more about Pontiacs and how to make real power.

[SStrokerAce]

Wow! lol

[SupStk]

We decided last night to go with the Edelbrocks. I know the heads can be worked to flow what I need but I was just trying to be lazy. Might try the KRE heads on something else.

Classking isn't lying, have hit 600ft lbs on several 455's myself although my HP is down about 9 from his. Could be the difference in cams, i've never used a hydraulic roller before on a pontiac.

Thanks for all the input.

[SupStk]

Reread classking's post, my torque and HP numbers were at higher rpm's and my best made 612HP.

Built another Pontiac with highly reworked Edelbrocks, 14.5 C/R and two 850's on a tunnel ram. seem like it made 712HP.... Brian B. do you still have that dyno data?

[tjs44]

I have to go with Bruce on this one as I do have a set of KRE D ports,IMO they are a nice replacement alu heads for 250-290 CFM D ports.I do think the Es have much more potential from the out of the box 290 CFM to the 330 range and from there I think the raised ports are in order.The super chief has been the leading N/A HP for a couple years now but it looks like the Tiger Head will surpass it for HP and cost to quality numbers.BUT as been said they require the aftermarket blocks with larger bores.Tom

[SchmidtMotorWorks]

looking at those Pontiac heads I wonder what the consequence of the extended exhaust ports is. Do they crack there? I bet they are difficult to port.

That said they would be really easy to cast, if they sell many of them it is probably not too bad of a business.

[Fatman]

My standard King Street 455:
240's @ .050 hyd roller
4.21 stroke
6.625 rod
10.4 Cr.
91 octane
600 lbs. ft. at 4000 rpm
621 hp at 5400 hp.
87 cc Edelbrock heads - my work.
RPM intake.
850 Speed Demon
No shaft rockers. No high ports.
You can do it.

Classking

Can you tell us what numbers these motors have run, and in what weight (inc driver)?

[ClassKing]

Too many to list. Just get a Moroso slide rule and see. I don't make a habit of talking to no-names - I made a post here because I know two of these people and Joe put his real name. Even tho I use a fun board name, everyone knows its me. Look at the web site for different weight cars and what they do. The Moroso slide rule is a fairly accurate "tool" as long as the chassis is working perfectly.

[Adger Smith]

I have had hyd roller designs ground on the steel cores. I have also used the std Hyd roller cores in a bunch of street/bracket engines with no problems. When used correctly I feel they wear better than the steel cores. Esp when you have to use a bronze dist gear. There is also an option for a 2 piece core that uses a steel core and a softer dist gear. (might not be available for Pontiac)
Comp uses a -8 as the last number to indicate the cast core. The Steel core is indicated by -9. Comp also has a Cam Profile/Lobe cat. that they can supply if you need to study the lobe designs & pick a non Cat. cam.
Call: Tim Cole, Gary Henderson, Gordon or Chris they can very helpful with your projects.

[ClassKing]

Adger:
I've been using both materials too, and like you said, used correctly I've never had a problem with either one. I used to have a west coast cam manufacturer install the cast iron gear to get away from the bronze gear wear problem, but now we have the composite gears available for the same price. Sold about 100 of these and I'm using them excusively in house. No failures. Hope it stays that way.

[putztastics]

I've seen numbers for an E-head 455 on my dyno very close to what Bruce posted. It was 13CR, mildly home ported, solid roller engine, all I did was the test and tune.

I was amazed to see 630+ chp though an 850 Holley DP.

I'm not sure if track times back up the results but I do know my dyno reads almost exactly the same as Vince Impostato's SF used in the 2003 EngineMasters. That dyno is also about the same as Westech is after the -5% correction Freiburger talked about.

[Adger Smith]

Bruce,
I have recently found some Pontiac forged steel rods & older heads that were hidden in one of the storage areas of my shop.
Is there any need or use for them? It appears I have sized the rods & put high strength rod bolts in them. The heads are the early, with the dog leg water passage. These must have been here for atleast 20 years.
E-mail me @ adgersperf@aol.com if you have a restoration or Pontiac purest that wants them.

[Fatman]

Classking

Just asking what they have run so that i wouldn't have to search through a website.Quite a valid question that i could imagine you could get from many potential customers.

I talk to all who have anything worthwhile to ask or say, even the no-names.