stack filtration

[Kevin Johnson]

Hm, the PTFE didn't help. The thinner/vaseline solution seemed to work, but the center of it was still not cured. Might indeed need a lot more time to cure fully.

Going to try a vaseline/white spirit solution next, since it will disolve better.

Try the cotton wick to introduce moisture to the center of the curing mass.

Another separating medium that you might consider is high viscosity silicone fluid. This is marketed as nozzle gel for mig welders with a colorant added as a disguise. Dielectric grease is generally a lower viscosity version. A point of caution! Many paint shops will not allow any sort of silicone product in the door because it will negatively affect subsequent painting. Keep this in mind if you plan on painting the surface.

Did you try the bar of soap?

If you are looking for animal fat products, pure lanolin would probably work. Neatsfoot oil is another possibility. All products that I used to sell.

[Belgian1979]

No i didn't try the wick method. Seems difficult with the large circumference I have to do on the box, which also has to be bolted in place to account for any deformation that may take place (I had to make parts with tools I have lying around and then the welding also did it's thing)

Thanks for the suggestions. Will try them out to find what works best in this situation.

[Cubic_Cleveland]

Do you have access to a mill to cut an o-ring groove in the lid? That seems like the easiest solution, either that or cutting a gasket out of a large sheet of rubber.

[Belgian1979]

No I haven't got acces to a mill. The lid aluminium is only 2 mm. Seems to thin to do anything like that.

I have thought about cutting a gasket out of sheets of gaskets as well, but those are only useable a couple of times. The silicone looked promising in that respect. So far I'm still waiting for the results of the dish wash soap I used last time. Curing seems to go slow on the rtv for some reason.

[Kevin Johnson]

There are manufacturers of extruded generic foam seals of many different cross-sections with adhesive backings and many other ways to attach. It did not occur to me to mention this before as I tend to focus on expressed technical aspects of a problem.

http://www.trimlok.com/

Many others exist as well.

[Kevin Johnson]

No I haven't got acces to a mill. The lid aluminium is only 2 mm. Seems to thin to do anything like that.

I have thought about cutting a gasket out of sheets of gaskets as well, but those are only useable a couple of times. The silicone looked promising in that respect. So far I'm still waiting for the results of the dish wash soap I used last time. Curing seems to go slow on the rtv for some reason.

Dish wash soap is generally a detergent.

[twl]

2mm is very thin for a large area flat lid on an airbox. It is going to flex in and out with the strong pressure pulses. I recommend some structural reinforcements for the lid, or some stud posts and neoprene washers in the central areas of the lid to control flexing.

[Belgian1979]

2mm is very thin for a large area flat lid on an airbox. It is going to flex in and out with the strong pressure pulses. I recommend some structural reinforcements for the lid, or some stud posts and neoprene washers in the central areas of the lid to control flexing.

I can also attache a second layer of 2 mm to it. Not sure how thick the metal needs to be for the pulses, but 2 mm is not that thin either.

[Belgian1979]

No I haven't got acces to a mill. The lid aluminium is only 2 mm. Seems to thin to do anything like that.

I have thought about cutting a gasket out of sheets of gaskets as well, but those are only useable a couple of times. The silicone looked promising in that respect. So far I'm still waiting for the results of the dish wash soap I used last time. Curing seems to go slow on the rtv for some reason.

Dish wash soap is generally a detergent.

Isn't soap in general a detergent ?

[Kevin Johnson]

2mm is very thin for a large area flat lid on an airbox. It is going to flex in and out with the strong pressure pulses. I recommend some structural reinforcements for the lid, or some stud posts and neoprene washers in the central areas of the lid to control flexing.

I can also attache a second layer of 2 mm to it. Not sure how thick the metal needs to be for the pulses, but 2 mm is not that thin either.

Make some long darts from the secondary sheet and spot weld them to the interior of the first. Just like a bonnet or hood.

[Kevin Johnson]

No I haven't got acces to a mill. The lid aluminium is only 2 mm. Seems to thin to do anything like that.

I have thought about cutting a gasket out of sheets of gaskets as well, but those are only useable a couple of times. The silicone looked promising in that respect. So far I'm still waiting for the results of the dish wash soap I used last time. Curing seems to go slow on the rtv for some reason.

Dish wash soap is generally a detergent.

Isn't soap in general a detergent ?

Soaps were used as processing aids in many industries. The soap industry (in the USA) has largely morphed into detergent manufacturers. I know because our firm was a primary manufacturer of soaps and distributed for many other manufacturers (including "detergents" which is indeed a more generic term). Soaps were used as a separating medium when making windshield gaskets. And on and on. It is an older technology.

Detergents solved an issue with precipitates or scum forming in hard water when soaps were used. They also make wonderful foam which hides filthy dirty water. You can also use them at an active level of .1% which is wonderful for profits. It is interesting how peoples' perceptions affect their buying choices. One surfactant that we sold was fairly fluid at room temperature (100% active). When you thinned it with water it thickened and people had the idea that the thicker mixture was more concentrated.

Anyways... Yes, it is important that you use an actual soap.

[Belgian1979]

Meanwhile, the test with the detergent : it came loose very easily....great so far, but it was also easy to peel of the non treated side. The silicone however was fully cured this time in only one day as in the previous test...strange.

[Belgian1979]

I worked on the setup some more. I'm going towards the finish line with it. I sealed of the valve cover breather with a piece of old inner tube from the wheel of a wheelbarrow and it worked out great.

I still haven't found a suitable way around the silicone issue though. I made new test, but this time with floor soap. So Kevin I hope you're right that it works differently;
All of the other things, especially the vaseline interfere with curing.
If the floor soap doesn't give any better results it will be dish wash detergent.

I planned on having an extra support for the airbox and this is where I have a question. Currently the box hangs on the stacks. It seems pretty solid, but nonetheless I was thinking on bracing it in some way to prevent putting too much stress on the stacks. Since they sit above the valve covers, I was thinking on epoxying a piece of alu which is just thick enough to fit between the box and the cover and then screw the box to the glued on piece of alu.

Would this work ? I'm not sure if the valve cover moves too much or not. I currently run a sort of plastic rubber type valve cover seal.

Disadvantage is that changing the seal of the valve covers, would mean a different hight and the distance would be lost.

[Belgian1979]

No luck with the silicone. A second test with soap on the actual airbox failed again, in the sense that the silicone was sticking to both the box as the lid. I'm going for the foam type seals now. Hopefully these stay alive under working conditions.

[englertracing]

This is what I've been using up until now.
The car had a big crash so when it's rebuilt I'll do something different with the filtration system.

Bill,
If you study the oem boxes on sport bikes,
They use RAM pipes that are tuned to help while the runners are out of tune.

And removing said airbox and replacing with pod filters.... Resultes in holes in the torque curve.