Rings,gap for boost?
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Rings,gap for boost?
I have been using the hellfire rings but I think they ware a bit fast[is it the finish?] but I also have used a gap of .032/.035 top/2nd and I feel I could go tighter to a .028 or .030 top on a 4.350 bore and 14 to 20# boost on 110 race gas with 30* locked timing 7AL-2.Could I use a ductile iron top ring or other type?I am looking at my options so please help me.I only ran my car a few times the last 3 yrs tuning in over rich carbs I messed up but have them much close now getting back to the factory jetting/bleeds on 2 1250 holley carbs.Thanks for the help!
"69"satellite,3900lbs,8-71,edel victor heads,I/C,446cu.in W/gas 1250 carbs
Re: Rings,gap for boost?
I'm using the Total Seal AP steel conventional with C33 face coating. Little harder to seat than a Hellfire, but easier on the bore and suppose to be long lived. .024" top @ 4.56'' bore but E85 so your deal is different with gas - gas is hot, so more gap. What's key to me is you don't want them to butt... the marginal, almost immeasurable gain you might see from a few thou in ring gap isn't worth the risk to me.
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Re: Rings,gap for boost?
On boosted engines I use a steeper cross hatch and use a different finish its not as fine as my STD. finish as I try to enhance oil control which seems to work.
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Re: Rings,gap for boost?
Thanks for the reply!I don't think I have all that much heat partially from the cam duration[I will post cam spec later today.260 ish at .050]I also have 10.50 cr static from a head switch with more chamber]from 95cc to 75cc]I understand this can get complecated but first I want to understand about the rings as a main topic.I will look at the rings mentioned and other info so I can decide within the next 2 weeks.THX!
"69"satellite,3900lbs,8-71,edel victor heads,I/C,446cu.in W/gas 1250 carbs
Re: Rings,gap for boost?
Over rich carbs? Theres a real good possibility you fuel washed the rings and cyls. or at least by having a rich fuel mixture some of the lubricating properties where compromised. I wouldn't use a iron ring in a boosted application,too much room for error. Stay with the recommended end gaps. That ring will work well.
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Re: Rings,gap for boost?
with the hellfire ring set?donc wrote:Over rich carbs? Theres a real good possibility you fuel washed the rings and cyls. or at least by having a rich fuel mixture some of the lubricating properties where compromised. I wouldn't use a iron ring in a boosted application,too much room for error. Stay with the recommended end gaps. That ring will work well.
"69"satellite,3900lbs,8-71,edel victor heads,I/C,446cu.in W/gas 1250 carbs
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Re: Rings,gap for boost?
are the total seal any more forgiving to rich fuel mix?
"69"satellite,3900lbs,8-71,edel victor heads,I/C,446cu.in W/gas 1250 carbs
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Re: Rings,gap for boost?
Hellfire rings will work well in any situation with boost. There is no plasma moly to knock loose due to high combustion pressure and/or detonation. These rings will seat well and last a long time if the manufacturer's instructions are followed exactly. As with any ring, cylinder preparation (and use of deck plates) is very important. Gap should be set to manufacturer's recommendation, there is no advantage in going any narrower and the carnage caused by the rings butting together is not worth the risk.
Bill
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Perfect Circle Doctor of Motors certification
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ASE Master Certified Engine Machinist (+ two otherASE Master Certifications)
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Re: Rings,gap for boost?
I'm using ~.0065xbore on my car....soon to be near 1200whp on 110 gas. Already made 1009 on pump
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Re: Rings,gap for boost?
Thanks I really appreciate the input!!!I have the engine stripped down to a short block so the piston will be out soon and I think only the rings need done.I may have .008 piston to wall with this hone but I should be good with that with no bad things showing on the sides of the pistons.
"69"satellite,3900lbs,8-71,edel victor heads,I/C,446cu.in W/gas 1250 carbs
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Re: Rings,gap for boost?
I got the block honed and fit the rings to .030 top and .028 2nd with the min spec on the 2nd ring .026
"69"satellite,3900lbs,8-71,edel victor heads,I/C,446cu.in W/gas 1250 carbs
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Re: Rings,gap for boost?
Force Fed Mopar wrote:Isn't a slightly larger 2nd gap desired?
Yes.
Bill
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Perfect Circle Doctor of Motors certification
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Re: Rings,gap for boost?
the 2nd ring is said to need .002 more as a guess but when the top ring heats up there is an expansion difference thus making the 2nd ring gap bigger than the top but I also have a gas expansion slot on the piston between the rings that helps that also.Force Fed Mopar wrote:Isn't a slightly larger 2nd gap desired?
"69"satellite,3900lbs,8-71,edel victor heads,I/C,446cu.in W/gas 1250 carbs
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Re: Rings,gap for boost?
Ahh I see.blownzoom440 wrote:the 2nd ring is said to need .002 more as a guess but when the top ring heats up there is an expansion difference thus making the 2nd ring gap bigger than the top but I also have a gas expansion slot on the piston between the rings that helps that also.Force Fed Mopar wrote:Isn't a slightly larger 2nd gap desired?
Rob M