roller lifters preventative replacement ?

[tjs44]

A lot,driven every week,a few 200 mile trips to car shows and back.OD trans so freeway driving was at 2000 to 2300.Just did a check and found my lash caps were going away.The cam is a high lift Hyd roller with lifters set at 6 thou.Called by many a hybrid setup.Tom

[steve cowan]

belgian,
i think 7000miles is plausable
most weekend warrior guys will do a couple hundred miles out cruizin
my closest track is 120 miles away
i am fairly fussy with this solid roller tappet deal,i will check prior to leaving,once at the track and when get home,change and cut and inspect oil filter
keep a diary,and twice now pulled intake to inspect roller lifter,
i have not had a failure yet,but i will say i am seriously thinking about wearing all my roller stuff out and going back to SFT cam and lifters
i have a couple of 500 -530 hp 383 sbc pump gas deals and in this day with the cam tech around 500 hp plus flat tappet cam is realistic,
i would rather spend my money on good block prep and bronze lifter bores done correctly (theres a can of worms in itself)
i only turn my stuff to 7300-7400rpm (500 past peak hp)
you sound like you got your show in check,we have all heard and seen new stuff crap out
walter made a good point with stuff getting beat up idling around
bigjoe says turn the idle way up
i like the sound of the tight lash roller cams but here again it is about cost,you add up quality roller cam,lifters, titanium retainers,titanium valves(i have a set of exyldyne in one of mine)heavy pushrods shaft rockers etc etc etc where do you stop
so what do you do belgian1979,do you buy another set of morals and send yours back to be rebuilt and have those as a spare set(i would)
i have read alot of guys here like the rev kit,i dont run one but am considering on a nitrous build i am doing at the moment
are the needle rollers get beat up on the lash ramp?
i am sure thats what i read
let us know what doing belgian as i am real interested in what all you guys are doing with these to big a roller cam deals that we use on the street
YUP we all want our cake and eat it to,and thats the trade off

steve c

[Belgian1979]

Thanks Steve,

I agree with most of what you've said. I didn't elect going to a flat tappet lifter as I also read a lot of cam failures due to the zinc content being lowered in the oils we use today. This is especially the case over here in Europe. You also have to remember that the EU is as bad as it can get regarding cars and pollution. So the situation is only going to get a lot worse here. Add to that we don't have nearly the amount of aftermarket race parts over the counter available like you in the us ( and in this case I mean specialized race oils - if they provide a solution and not create another) and the choice is not as cut and dry as one would think.

I already set my counter at 7000 miles (10000 kms) and try to keep check about lash. Fortunately the car is not a daily driver deal, so it gets not a lot of miles. So far they gave no crimp, but I'm afraid when they do, it will be too late already.

During tuning I've also used my knock detector which is actually a microphone inside the engine. You can clearly hear the valve lifters and valves make noises. Maybe I'm able to discern a lifter going away before it gets to a disaster.

[Krooser]

So why can a guy get 250,000 miles plus out of a set of OEM roller lifters and only 7K out of the aftermarket pieces/

[PackardV8]

So why can a guy get 250,000 miles plus out of a set of OEM roller lifters and only 7K out of the aftermarket pieces/

apples-to-apples, if the aftermarket lifters were installed on the OEM cam and under the OEM springs and revs held down to OEM levels, they'd last indefinitely. It's the building a setup with the aggressive lobe profiles, the higher lift and the higher spring pressures and the higher revs used in the aftermarket setups and then still trying to idle it around the fairgrounds and cruise nights which kill lifters.

[1989TransAm]

The "latest" thing is low lash solid rollers. These are becoming more popular with LS style street type motors. Kip at Cam Motion has over 15,000 miles the last I heard on his vehicle. Many install them with out having to reset the lash while others having to reset the lash once including myself. A number of people are now selling them. The lash will be determined if you have aluminum heads and block or iron block and aluminum heads for example.

[Belgian1979]

Basically I understand Wöhlers theory about load and cycles. In essence it says that the more load you put on something the less the cycles it can have before fatique occurs. The curve is not linear, meaning that the more load creates a lot less cycles of life.... but from engineering standpoint this can be combatted. The question here is what is excessive. Is it the spring pressures or is the shock loading ? We've had this discussion before but needle bearings are even used in 2T motors which have to live with minimal loading and the stress is also higher.

I don't see how a plain bearing would survive in that environment (bushed lifters), in the sense that a plain bearing would need a play and an oil wedge to function. I don't see how that would be possible in lifters.
Anyway a post of 540RAT about bushed lifers...http://www.corvetteforum.com/forums/c3- ... fter.htmlµ
Turns out that although they held out longer they were not holding up that much longer. He's attributing it to hammering now.

Would seem to me that a revkit would solve this (if this is the cause that is)

[wyrmrider]

540 Rat to the Rescue

[Belgian1979]

Not to the rescue. Not all he's saying I'm agreeing with, but he's certainly got some good points.

[The Radius Kid]

I'd say old Rat isn't very far off the mark at all.
A little reading:

http://www.stle.org/files/What_is_tribo ... ology.aspx

http://www.amesweb.info/HertzianContact ... ntact.aspx