Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

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GARY C
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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by GARY C » Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:23 am

gvx wrote:
Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:20 am
GARY C wrote:
Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:11 am
Just trying to figure out the quote under his pic on last page,"Recent R&D ( Race em and Destroy em) from a set of my heads. Way before flowbench. N.A. street stuff. Working on it M.T. Thanks, Charlie"
I always ran small cube nitrous engines from 700 to 900 horse, 7000 to 8000 rpm I just never broke anything, so is that because I didn't port my heads correctly?
Sorry Gary you didn't get it. That wasn't intended as being critical of you. I just find engines sexy, my comment was sexual innuendo LOL
S!ut! :D
BTW that is a joke! not trying to offend

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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by GARY C » Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:32 am

To bad we can't do actual voice communications here, it would change how things are taken and be much more exciting.

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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by PRH » Sat Oct 07, 2017 11:55 am

Okay.........here's a loaded question.....

How much power do these heads have to make to justify all the porting time, plus the repairing of the holes, etc........ To be considered a success?

If they got pulled off the motor on the dyno, and a set of similar sized decent off the shelf heads were installed in their place...... Like an AFR 227...... How much more power do these Darts have to make to feel like it was worth the effort?

I don't know what the intended home for these is supposed to be, but lets say it was something like a 406-434 build.
Somewhat handy with a die grinder.

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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by Carnut1 » Sat Oct 07, 2017 12:25 pm

Original plan was 440 ci 700 hp.
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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by GARY C » Sat Oct 07, 2017 2:02 pm

PRH wrote:
Sat Oct 07, 2017 11:55 am
Okay.........here's a loaded question.....

How much power do these heads have to make to justify all the porting time, plus the repairing of the holes, etc........ To be considered a success?

If they got pulled off the motor on the dyno, and a set of similar sized decent off the shelf heads were installed in their place...... Like an AFR 227...... How much more power do these Darts have to make to feel like it was worth the effort?

I don't know what the intended home for these is supposed to be, but lets say it was something like a 406-434 build.
The first set of heads I ported was the earlyest version of the 230cc Pro 1's for a 13.5ish compression 379 ci sbc, the only reference I had was mag and book pictures (pre internet) so I did not get to extreme for fear of making them worse.
I did a little unshrouding and chamber clean, bowl work, the st and port were basically done enough to remove the casting look and matched to a felpro 1206 gasket.
The car picked up a 1/2 second in the 1/8 mile, that is what the car picked up on a 150 nitrous shot before porting.
All though I have never timed my self, once you know what your doing you would probably have around 8 to 16 hours in a set of heads depending on how much work you were doing to them.

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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by PRH » Sat Oct 07, 2017 2:49 pm

I doubt I could hand port a set of 200cc SBC heads out to 240cc, along with a similar amount of reworking of the ex ports, and the chamber mods in 16hrs.
But......I'm getting old and probably don't work as fast as others.

Then there's the welding up the spring seats....... And tubing the head bolt holes.

I'm just wondering what the consensus is on how much better they'd have to be than what's available off the shelf to justify the added work.

I will say that Carnut has shown some real tenacity in reworking these heads.
Looking back at the numbers from page 1....... 290 @224cc's....... I'd have patted myself on the back and called it "good to go".
Somewhat handy with a die grinder.

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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by GARY C » Sat Oct 07, 2017 4:31 pm

PRH wrote:
Sat Oct 07, 2017 2:49 pm
I doubt I could hand port a set of 200cc SBC heads out to 240cc, along with a similar amount of reworking of the ex ports, and the chamber mods in 16hrs.
But......I'm getting old and probably don't work as fast as others.

Then there's the welding up the spring seats....... And tubing the head bolt holes.

I'm just wondering what the consensus is on how much better they'd have to be than what's available off the shelf to justify the added work.

I will say that Carnut has shown some real tenacity in reworking these heads.
Looking back at the numbers from page 1....... 290 @224cc's....... I'd have patted myself on the back and called it "good to go".
Depending on your cubes and RPM you probably would never need that large of a runner, 2 friends of mine did 421's with moderate heads, one was an out of the box 227 AFR pre eliminator that flowed about 309cfm on my bench cammed for NOS per DV's cam master and dynoed near 650 horse straight motor, shifted at 7000 and went through the traps 1/8 mile just over 6800.

The other was a ported Track 1 head, I think in the 230 range but it's been a while since that discussion happened, it was a little better though out and dynoed 675 straight motor.

If I was to try to go 240 cc I would probably start with a 220is runner, I think the 230 has to low of a short turn but I could be wrong.
A mildly worked 200cc head with a 2.08 valve will flow in the 300 cfm range at .700 lift but would be sized for smaller ci of course.

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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by David Vizard » Sat Oct 07, 2017 7:52 pm

I have not had time to look all through the posts here so this may be doubling up on stuff already posted.

Charlie, If you can post the cfm per sqr inch graph I will be able to ascertain whether or not the port is windowing at lifts above 0.25D.

This may or may not help your flow situation.

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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by David Vizard » Sat Oct 07, 2017 7:56 pm

PRH wrote:
Sat Oct 07, 2017 2:49 pm
I doubt I could hand port a set of 200cc SBC heads out to 240cc, along with a similar amount of reworking of the ex ports, and the chamber mods in 16hrs.
But......I'm getting old and probably don't work as fast as others.

Then there's the welding up the spring seats....... And tubing the head bolt holes.

I'm just wondering what the consensus is on how much better they'd have to be than what's available off the shelf to justify the added work.

I will say that Carnut has shown some real tenacity in reworking these heads.
Looking back at the numbers from page 1....... 290 @224cc's....... I'd have patted myself on the back and called it "good to go".
PHR,

I'm with you 100% on that last observation.

DV
David Vizard Small Group Performance Seminars - held about every 4 weeks. My shop or your shop. Contact seminar organizer at marvingvx@gmail.com for details.

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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by Carnut1 » Sun Oct 08, 2017 3:26 pm

Resized_20170804_210235.jpeg
Having computer issues and my daughter isn't home so I can post an older graph. Chad's cnc 205 head ( thin lines) vs. Dart 247 hand ported ( thick lines) 2.08 /1.6 valves equal .52" lift intake and .4" lift exhaust for .25d. Interested in input. Thanks, Charlie
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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by Carnut1 » Wed Dec 27, 2017 3:05 pm

Interesting to compare some info on this thread to the ported dart 215 platinum head thread.
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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by cuisinartvette » Thu Dec 28, 2017 10:27 pm

Keep up the good work, digging the pics
Guess the "is it worth it" depends on what hes getting paid :mrgreen:

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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by Carnut1 » Sun Dec 31, 2017 7:37 am

I read through this thread again when I realized my Dart 215 exhaust ports were a bit sad. I applied some advice given in this thread and was rewarded with a 20 cfm loss! Luckily I did this on my "extra" head! Interested to see what happens after learning this lesson. Two more ports to figure it out. Thanks, Charlie
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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by Carnut1 » Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:53 am

1231170840.jpg
I see my Dart 215 thread has been locked so I guess that is done. Today one last experiment on the 215's before moving on. Full radius on both ports using very old double cut burr. If this extra head ever gets used it will most likely get larger ports and possibly different sized valves. Dart 215 comes with 5 angle on the intake and full radius exhaust. I have notice another thread recently vanished. I was looking forward to it, high end airflow. Reminds me of the book "Animal Farm" Charlie
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Re: Ported Dart pro 1 pre platinum

Post by RevTheory » Sun Dec 31, 2017 11:19 am

As always, excellent work!

It's unfortunate that the same never-DV crew got your other thread shut down. They can't seem to help themselves.

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