AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

[amcenthusiast]

Many different comments... thanks for your interest.

(Yes I got chatter cutting down the valves, especially the stainless steel exhaust valves so I just slow down the feed while cutting & chase the cuts with a variety of grinding and polishing tools using magnifying glass)

Hello J. Vines, I'm a long time member of your silent fan club? noticing your Packard comments all over the Internet for many years now.

So the links work to the picture albums/thanks for feedback; I have no other way of knowing. These picture albums are all made using Google+ and Google Photos for free. I think I would have to pay to have them available to common search engines like Yahoo...

It's another one of those questions 'where do you buy a race cam for Rambler V8?'

And this was another reason I chose to make my own lathe having certain size parts in mind; to make many other necessary parts that simply are not made for this engine.

I chose D. Elgin because his information page seemed intelligent and most open-minded to 'other make' engines.

-was able to trim about 1/2 lb. off a used cam core and true up the 'fairly straight' factory casting prior to sending the cam to have it cut.

-so the cam has a reduced shaft diameter and the sides of the lobes are 'cleaned up'

It took eleven and a half weeks to have it done but Elgin & crew cut the cam I asked for; lopey idle, 2500 to 5000 rpm powerband, .480" allowable lift because of valve spring coil bind.

(I showed him the picture albums of the heads, crank, pistons etc and D. Elgin said he enjoyed the project -he's a member of SAE and said he put this 443 cam 'on record')

IMO? it's a perfect street-strip cam; nice lopey idle but great throttle response.

J. Vines won't like it because it's hydraulic but this is a valve train I can afford for now.

Here's a link to the cam album: https://goo.gl/photos/k6LmCMu7MSQ5Fm9VA

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[Carnut1]

Those rocker arms look like a non adjustable version of my 1959 f134 Willys engine.

[PackardV8]

Those rocker arms look like a non adjustable version of my 1959 f134 Willys engine.

There's a obsolete marque urban legend some of the guys who worked on this first AMC V8 came from the team who designed the never-produced Kaiser-Frazer V8. So could have been some of the guys who did the F-head for Willys.

https://macsmotorcitygarage.com/a-v8-th ... razer-288/

In Motor City car lore, from here the story goes that when the Kaiser-Frazer V8 project folded, engineer Dave Potter was quickly grabbed up by American Motors and the stillborn K-F V8 became the first-generation AMC V8. (Well worth mentioning here: Assisting Potter at AMC was British engineer Len Bailey, who later played a key role in the Ford GT program.)

It’s a really great story with one problem: the production AMC V8 has absolutely nothing in common with the K-F V8. They’re totally different animals from the drain plug up. We can see here that Potter went in a whole new direction on the AMC V8. Often, that’s the power of experience in engineering. Know-how is one thing, but knowing how not to do it can be equally valuable.

[pdq67]

I love this project! I actually built a very similar stone holder for a Black and Decker stone kit I bought that was forgotten from my local autoparts store. I welded a valve stem to a piece of threaded rod and made tapered nuts to hold the stones. I bet it runs real sweet. Nice job.

Charlie,

After looking the chamber pictures over, I can see where the spiral/offset indented plug location comes from.

I never had seen any of these old engine heads before.

pdq67

[Carnut1]

The chamber is not quite modern but designed in the 50's it is light-years ahead of the junk Chevy was using for chambers.

[amcenthusiast]

Yes there's always a 'paper tiger' war on for AMC History but I've decided I'm not going to tangle with it... on paper.

In my world, if it doesn't run, it's junk.

No such thing as a 'race roller cam timing set for Rambler V8' so I make 'em now starting with any '66-'91 AM V8 roller set (same center to center distance)

Link to 'XRV8 Roller Timing Set for Rambler V8':

https://goo.gl/photos/ZBgkqrAN9kdFDZ837

Back to topic; if the heads aren't any good, why waste the time and effort?

So I've tried to build a good intake and set of headers to hopefully get the most out these heads on this engine.

Having 1.56 rod ratio asks for 'big intake' side like 454 BBC?

So here's the intake:

https://goo.gl/photos/yrtjrCN73sBApvQNA

The space around the engine installed into AMC 'small chassis' Gremlin pretty much dictates where the tubes need to go. Shooting for 40" tubes, I was able to make 30" tubes, in order to meet other criteria like -removable starter motor, ground clearance for street duty, reaching bellhousing bolts etc.

http://www.epi-eng.com/piston_engine_te ... nology.htm

http://headersbyed.com/+hcomments.htm

(Headers by Ed actually makes header flanges for Rambler V8)



Link to Rambler V8 headers/AMC Gremlin album:

https://goo.gl/photos/sEnUSBDMd2Jo4ieX6

(My Mom had a heart attack while I was making the passenger side header so that made me finish up that one without the same degree of craftsmanship as the driver's side)

[AMXstocker1]

Being a huge AMC Fan this is amazing i love it. if you get to the track or dyno i'd be very interested to know how it goes. and can we get a picture of the whole car? Thanks for sharing an amazing project.

[PackardV8]

More really nice work.

If you told us how it got to 443", I missed it. What is the bore and what pistons did you modify? What is the stroke and who did the crank?

[amcenthusiast]

-took me so long to post the previous info, I missed comments on RV8 combustion chambers...

Yes, the combustion chambers are partly why I'd like to show and tell more about the heads.

Each aspect; intake ports, combustion chambers and exhaust ports all show obvious deliberate swirl flow design.

Comparison to Chevy is easiest because those heads are the most well known.

The intake ports use a 'ledge' under the outer side of the intake valve seat in conjunction with the valve stem closer to the opposite side of the port which may act partly like a dam, to induce swirl flow. -This swirl flow design could be compared to Chevy Vortec intake ports.

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As stated in by AMC engineers in their presentation to SAE in '56, the combustion chambers have a 'hump' to increase swirl effect to incoming air-fuel mix... but what is interesting about that statement is the noticeable missing information; the hump creates swirl flow as piston approaches TDC. Then swirling air-fuel mix turbulates near the spark plug location to begin a hotter burn pattern expanding from the spark plug tip. Debatable: The flame front and burn event proceed after spark ignition with swirl flow for plausible better power distribution onto the piston?

Compare to Chevy LT1 chamber:

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Compared to 443 XRV8 chamber:

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Debatable? Notice 'old school' exhaust ports exit the chamber at an angle, where scavenging effect pulls more from center area of the cylinder? But this also has an apparent swirl flow design? :

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The chamber itself is not an emission design, but Chevrolet was able to revive it and pass emission laws with fuel injection and cats.

[amcenthusiast]

Thanks for comments and looking forward to show and tell about DIY welded crankshaft!

It's still oversquare: 4.155" bore x 4.082" stroke ...the standard 4" bore block got bored .050" three times!

Looking forward to show and tell about DIY block filler install also. (engine runs correct temp/no problems/does not overheat)

Please be patient I'll get around to it if all goes well.

[Truckedup]

It's great to see a true home build engine

[amcenthusiast]

Thanks for positive comment.

I can post more pictures of crankshaft here, if y'all would like. Here's link to picture album:

https://goo.gl/photos/7AeHSr96btwJ4xff9

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Enjoy! Pistons and connecting rods next?

[rebelrouser]

Looks like a neat build, good work. I just did a set of heads for a 401 in a mud jeep, I used mopar valves out of a 440 head, and changed the intake seat angle to 45 degrees. Did you retain the 30 degree seats? I seen improvements on my bench by switching the seat angles to 45 degrees, should be installing the engine in a few days to see if it works better in real life.

[amcenthusiast]

Thanks for comradery. I bet that lightweight Jeep is lots of fun with 401.

Ok... yes later '66-'91 AM V8s have a wider valve stem spacing than earlier '56-'67 AM RV8 design. Seems to always be a trade off between 'valve curtain area' and shrouding caused by chamber wall or cylinder wall.

I don't have beans for feed bag tooling right now and of coarse valve seats are like secret recipes used by chefs to make hoarsepower meat taste good. Mopars use big fat heavy chop sticks too? Bon Appetite!


That is a DIY welded stroker crank; all welding work done by me on homebuilt firepit for pre-heat and post heat cool down sessions. I used carbon rod 'plugs' to extend oiling passageways... about two and one half years worth of 'every now and then'/untold hours grinding, shaping and polishing the cheeks.

Credit where credit is due:

'Milo' ('THE MAN!') at 'E & E Engine and Machine' San Antonio, Tx. cut the crank ~wow~ ...at one point, he called me and said (drawing his breath) 'uh... there's a lot of metal coming off this crank' (I'll never forget hearing him say that. -sure was a hideous monster when I brought it in to have it cut!) Cost about $2250 total = @ $60 an hour. ...all paid in cash by me, in partial payments, which made it affordable on my budget.

'Duffin Machine Shop' San Antonio, Tx. allowed me to bring in my whacko-out-of-balance crank and have it checked on their old Stewart Warner dynamic balancing machine for $75 a pop, whenever I wanted to. (I did the bulk of the actual/physical re-balance work myself -drilling/calculating strategic lighting holes, adding bits of metal or lead plugs here and there and welding plates onto the end cheeks etc -with their help)

'Mission Auto Parts' San Antonio, Tx. employs 'THE MAN' who did the final dynamic balancing work (his name should go here) -obviously very good at his job/'done' only two working days later for $250

Hence, the custom welded precision internal balanced crank was the main cost of building this engine (over half the total cost)

The auto trans flexiplate and lightened front harmonic dampener are 'true' neutral balanced.

Bear with me & I'll be able to dredge up all the component weights... if only for sake of comparison to more popular 'other make' engines.

[levisnteeshirt]

You should contact Barry Allen , in Bolt, Wv , he might be of great help to you , and would be tickled to see this ,,, he had a set of home made alum heads for an AMC in the early 90s, he ran in comp eliminate I think back then