AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by amcenthusiast » Fri Jul 21, 2017 11:00 am

Hi, thank you for your insightful reply; there is definitely more science concerning an exhaust crossover than what is typically discussed.

So far I've only experimented with 1 1/2" and 1 5/8' diameter tubing for exhaust crossover on this engine.

Yes I believe many of the early US V8 engines had their exhaust system designed this way to help resolve tuning/design errors related to 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2 firing order.

Still currently working on shop drawings to help explain the custom made headers for this engine; yes it has it's very own sound signature, distinctly different from other 'modern/conventional' V8s.

(intending to show three shop drawings to compare 1) conventional header system 2)180 degree header system and 3) custom header system made for this engine; worked on the drawings last night, but I'm bogged down during daylight working on a '69 AMC Rebel project car)

Here's another good article to increase understanding of resonant interference:

https://courses.lumenlearning.com/physi ... r-columns/
XRV8 Race Parts > for AM's '56-'67 Rambler V8: http://amcramblermarlin.1colony.com/favorite_links.html

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by amcenthusiast » Fri Sep 22, 2017 12:59 pm

Hoping anyone who is interested in porting might benefit from studying the thermodynamic and sound wave theories in the aforementioned websites.

Two shop drawings for discussing conventional and Rambler V8 exhaust header designs by contrast and comparison: and [img]
004.JPG
004.JPG
002.JPG
[/img]

Hoping the drawings help to express the ideas more clearly.

Proof of XRV8 RP Rambler V8 Header design ownership implied.

Thank you SpeedTalk for allowing us to discuss our favorite engines here.
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XRV8 Race Parts > for AM's '56-'67 Rambler V8: http://amcramblermarlin.1colony.com/favorite_links.html

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by DaveMcLain » Fri Sep 22, 2017 1:27 pm

amcenthusiast wrote:Hoping anyone who is interested in porting might benefit from studying the thermodynamic and sound wave theories in the aforementioned websites.

Two shop drawings for discussing conventional and Rambler V8 exhaust header designs by contrast and comparison: and [img]004.JPG004.JPG002.JPG[/img]

Hoping the drawings help to express the ideas more clearly.

Proof of XRV8 RP Rambler V8 Header design ownership implied.

Thank you SpeedTalk for allowing us to discuss our favorite engines here.
Unfortunately intake and exhaust system wave tuning does not use "sound wave" theories. I think they are called Finite Amplitude Waves and they do not work the same. For instance when two sound waves travelling in opposite directions collide they pass right through one another whereas with finite amplitude waves they interact very strongly with one another.

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by AMXstocker1 » Fri Sep 22, 2017 2:09 pm

I was told your should put your tubes in the collector so they fire in a circle one direction or the other to help with scavenging?

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by vortecpro » Sat Sep 23, 2017 7:51 am

Very cool!
Racing a NA NHRA stocker should be mandatory before any posting.

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by amcenthusiast » Sat Sep 23, 2017 12:30 pm

Oh no, I wish we could delete statements made here on SpeedTalk forum, for people to have a way out of a bind when they may have said something 'less than accurate' (I feel terrible when I said something 'less than correct' and it becomes published, in public)

I'm only trying to be polite, not to embarrass people by differing them to the other topics such as Thermodynamics. (heat is of the essence of these power making 'engines'; define 'thermo', define 'dynamics')

Sound waves = vibration, and in the case of exhaust system design, sound wave theory helps us to understand what those vibrating exhaust notes are doing inside our exhaust system's components.

This is why I'm claiming ownership of my Rambler V8 header design; I am the designer and maker of the sound they make, just a musician may claim ownership of a song.

...it's no big deal really (vanity on my behalf?) but the concept of making a second chamber to duplicate the effect a crossover pipe has on a siamese center port V8, in order to create similar scavenging waves for the other four end ports of the engine is ...not a copied design from any other header maker source (such as "Headers by Ed" at headersbyed.com)

Studying sound wave theory helps us to at least make more accurate use of the terms; what is a 'harmonic dampener'? and what does it do?

What is a 'scavenging wave'? or what does a 'chambered muffler' do?

Good website with well written pages on 'Acoustics':

http://www.indiana.edu/%7Eemusic/etext/ ... ntro.shtml

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ah yes, -to have the pulses move in a circular motion inside the 180 degree header's collector...

Congratulations! You noticed the glitch; define 'astute'.

(No I don't own the 180 degree header design! -only made the drawing for visual comparison and mental stimulation)
XRV8 Race Parts > for AM's '56-'67 Rambler V8: http://amcramblermarlin.1colony.com/favorite_links.html

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by amcenthusiast » Sat Sep 23, 2017 1:51 pm

Having established somewhat the importance of heat when it comes to discussing cylinder head port design, at this point I would like to offer info and pics to show and describe other aspects the engine.

Here, I'll just move on and begin showing pictures of the block...
XRV8 Race Parts > for AM's '56-'67 Rambler V8: http://amcramblermarlin.1colony.com/favorite_links.html

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by DaveMcLain » Sat Sep 23, 2017 5:41 pm

amcenthusiast wrote:
Sound waves = vibration, and in the case of exhaust system design, sound wave theory helps us to understand what those vibrating exhaust notes are doing inside our exhaust system's components.

This is why I'm claiming ownership of my Rambler V8 heade
No it does not.

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by amcenthusiast » Sun Sep 24, 2017 8:29 pm

Please enjoy the rich sources of information at your own leisure... such as:

http://www.physicsclassroom.com/class/s ... ssure-Wave

My favorite Physics site is:

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/hframe.html

----------------------------------------------------------------------

-Changed my mind thinking that before I begin to show the Rambler V8 block pictures I'd go ahead and show pics of 'other make' US V8 engines which have a similar head design, having siamesed center exhaust ports... just for comparison & increased familiarity...
XRV8 Race Parts > for AM's '56-'67 Rambler V8: http://amcramblermarlin.1colony.com/favorite_links.html

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by amcenthusiast » Wed Sep 27, 2017 4:21 pm

In my opinion, visual and mechanical comparison to several 'other make' mid-fifties cylinder heads tends to diminish negative attitude against '56-'67 Rambler V8 hop up potential and proves they were otherwise more conventional, especially when we understand these are those companies who American Motors felt compelled to compete against:

[img]
62CadHed.jpg
[/img]

[img]
55PakHed.jpg
[/img]

[img]
56PontHed.jpg
[/img]

[img]
Studehed.jpg
[/img]

Of course this is not a complete comparison, neglecting to show many other mid-fifties V8 cylinder head designs which are surprisingly odd by their unconventional uniqueness...

By my studies, in the late sixties growing concern to meet new US Federal emission control laws was the bottleneck which forced all US automakers to switch to using simple wedge shaped combustion chambers which were considered to be the easiest shape for engineers to devise ways to control toxic emissions.
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XRV8 Race Parts > for AM's '56-'67 Rambler V8: http://amcramblermarlin.1colony.com/favorite_links.html

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by PackardV8 » Wed Sep 27, 2017 4:30 pm

Those you list, AMC, Cadillac, Pontiac, Packard and Studebaker, should include the Oldsmobile. They were all known as first-generation Kettering designs and share many similarities; siamesed center exhaust ports, air gap intakes, rear distributors, cartridge water pumps on a separate manifold. a Kettering had them overbuilt to withstand the 12:1 compression ratios and 120 octane fuels which never happened, so they're heavier than need be.

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by amcenthusiast » Wed Sep 27, 2017 5:40 pm

Ok, thank you J.V. for this info on casting thickness anticipating superior fuel -missing information... -did not know the early Olds heads were siamese center port exhaust also. -thanks
XRV8 Race Parts > for AM's '56-'67 Rambler V8: http://amcramblermarlin.1colony.com/favorite_links.html

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by brechlrl » Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:28 pm

52-63 Lincoln Y block also has paired center exhaust ports as well as the Ford Y Block

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by brechlrl » Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:30 pm

OOOPS paired but not Siamesed

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Re: AMC 327 - 443 CID Rambler V8

Post by amcenthusiast » Wed Sep 27, 2017 10:22 pm

I admire Mummert and look to his work for inspiration: http://www.ford-y-block.com/

but also 'Uncommon Engineering': http://uncommonengineering.com/index.html
XRV8 Race Parts > for AM's '56-'67 Rambler V8: http://amcramblermarlin.1colony.com/favorite_links.html

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