Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

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andyf
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by andyf »

I like that style of build, more interesting to me than engines that look like a Pep Boys catalog but don't run very well. Only thing I didn't understand was the cam selection but I'm sure there was a reason for it.

I am working on a 482 inch FE engine right now that will use the same Galaxie headers. The 482 might make a bit more power than this build but it should be in the same neighborhood. There is only so much that you'll get out of a street friendly, pump gas FE.
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by vortecpro »

I think its a nice build-Great Work.
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by vortecpro »

oldhead wrote: Thu Nov 23, 2017 7:25 pm Take a look,they think its great at 554 hp, I am thinking a BBC could beat that by atleast 50 hp with the same limitations. What you think :D :D :D :D Oldhead PS:You guess right,I love chevys
I love BBC too! I think its important to know where the numbers come from. Example: If your comparing a 554 HP FE too a stock 302 Chevy build that made "430" HP it would seem the FE is low on HP, but in reality the 302 probably didn't really make 430 stock. Don't take me wrong just trying to give you something to think about. I like the idea of a 10 sec stock looking FE.....don't you?
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by tt 383 »

How strong are the FEmale blocks?
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by Barry_R »

tt 383 wrote: Sun Nov 26, 2017 7:13 pm How strong are the FEmale blocks?
Stronger than you are...big boy :)
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by tt 383 »

Haha I been waiting to use that for awhile... It was a serious question though. I don't know much about the Ford blocks at all. It seems like they had some good ideas and should have pulled them all together, or maybe they did idk? For the record I am not partial or biased to any make, I appreciate what was done and shared here as I'm sure everyone else was.
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by SRS_Chris »

The FE engines were top notch back in their time (early-mid 60's) in my opinion. The pre-side oiler FE's had a less than stellar oiling system, but Ford addressed that with the side-oiler. The performance FE's had a few "features" that have carried forward to modern day engines (deep skirts and cross-bolted main caps for example). The heads on the early FE's were shit, and the "good" FE heads (I can't speak to the tunnel port heads) were not much better in my opinion. Put a decent set of heads on the FE, like in the article in question, and you have a nice engine.
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by blykins »

andyf wrote: Sun Nov 26, 2017 4:06 pm I like that style of build, more interesting to me than engines that look like a Pep Boys catalog but don't run very well. Only thing I didn't understand was the cam selection but I'm sure there was a reason for it.

I am working on a 482 inch FE engine right now that will use the same Galaxie headers. The 482 might make a bit more power than this build but it should be in the same neighborhood. There is only so much that you'll get out of a street friendly, pump gas FE.
That cam selection wasn't Barry's first choice. His first choice was a custom camshaft designed for EMC-style conditions. Unfortunately a lobe went flat and he had to substitute another camshaft, last minute. That last minute substitute was one of the most vanilla camshafts made for an FE, and nowhere duplicated the hp/tq/curves that the custom generated.
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by blykins »

SRS_Chris wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2017 12:21 am The FE engines were top notch back in their time (early-mid 60's) in my opinion. The pre-side oiler FE's had a less than stellar oiling system, but Ford addressed that with the side-oiler. The performance FE's had a few "features" that have carried forward to modern day engines (deep skirts and cross-bolted main caps for example). The heads on the early FE's were shit, and the "good" FE heads (I can't speak to the tunnel port heads) were not much better in my opinion. Put a decent set of heads on the FE, like in the article in question, and you have a nice engine.
Stock for stock, I don't know if I would be so hard on the FE heads. I'm primarily a Ford builder (mostly Clevelands and FE's), but have dabbled in a few BBC builds. I built a 428CJ and a 427 BBC a few years back and they were within 5-10 hp of each other. These were factory headed engines, factory intakes, modern pistons, and modern custom hydraulic roller camshafts. It's been a bit, but I can look up the specs and dyno sheets if interested.

The HR and TP heads were very healthy pieces. They both will approach 370-380 cfm with some work, with the majority of the work on the TP head consisting of closing up the CSA.

I would consider the oiling issues to not really be an issue. The beauty of the 427 blocks was in the strength of the bottom end.
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by Steve.k »

I wonder how many trophies the fe motor has compared to any chevy? Still waiting to see chevy go 123 at lemans. Hm FE.The constraints of build the little Fe did very well.
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by n2xlr8n »

Barry_R wrote: Sun Nov 26, 2017 11:41 am Bring your 396 with cast manifolds and a straight pattern flat tappet & we can compare
Let the crickets begin :lol:

Nice job, Barry.
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by Barry_R »

Mr. L is correct regarding the cam selection - it was the result of testing failure. I had a particularly assertive flat tappet (per the rules) and saw some signs of valve train control issues after numerous pulls. Tried a couple things and recognized that something was "going on" and found indications of imminent disaster. With only a week left I went to the shelf and grabbed the only cam I had in stock that met the rules - the venerable 294S Comp Magnum with the "Pro-Street sound".

Peak power was nearly the same running with headers, but the torque curve and score were way down. Since I had already run another competitor engine on my dyno I knew that the reduced score was not going to be podium material - so I went for the cool factor and ran with the manifolds.
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by Truckedup »

Steve.k wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:50 pm I wonder how many trophies the fe motor has compared to any chevy? Still waiting to see chevy go 123 at lemans. Hm FE.The constraints of build the little Fe did very well.
123 at Lemans with massive Ford factory backing.....Trophies? I think it's safe to say BBC has 10 times the track wins of Fe's if you consider what goes on at dozens of drag strips every weekend...
552 HP from the "conservative" build is a nice number for any engine
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by DaveMcLain »

Truckedup wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2017 7:03 am
Steve.k wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:50 pm I wonder how many trophies the fe motor has compared to any chevy? Still waiting to see chevy go 123 at lemans. Hm FE.The constraints of build the little Fe did very well.
123 at Lemans with massive Ford factory backing.....Trophies? I think it's safe to say BBC has 10 times the track wins of Fe's if you consider what goes on at dozens of drag strips every weekend...
552 HP from the "conservative" build is a nice number for any engine
Back when Dick Trickle won 67 features in one season he ran a Ford FE engine... I think one of the main problems with the FE is that Ford just didn't build enough of the large bore/427's and that made a lot of the good parts rather expensive.
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Re: Enginelabs just dis a BB ford

Post by randy331 »

Barry_R wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2017 6:35 am Mr. L is correct regarding the cam selection - it was the result of testing failure. I had a particularly assertive flat tappet (per the rules) and saw some signs of valve train control issues after numerous pulls. Tried a couple things and recognized that something was "going on" and found indications of imminent disaster. With only a week left I went to the shelf and grabbed the only cam I had in stock that met the rules - the venerable 294S Comp Magnum with the "Pro-Street sound".

Peak power was nearly the same running with headers, but the torque curve and score were way down. Since I had already run another competitor engine on my dyno I knew that the reduced score was not going to be podium material - so I went for the cool factor and ran with the manifolds.
The flat tappet cam rule was one thing I didn't like about this years EMC. We worried about it with our engine but all the cams we tested came out looking good, and I know some others lost cams too close to the competition to repair, so the EMC had a couple less engines there because of that rule.

Nice build.
What's the plans for your stealth build ?

Randy
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