Towing/long term durability Ford 5.4 vs 3.5 ecoboost

[FC-Pilot]

"Field testing" can not do the kind of abuse that owners do. Manufacturers will have vehicles out on the road testing almost 24 hours a day gathering data, they will do 240 hour WOT pulls with complete cooldowns every so often so the pull can start from a subzero engine, all sorts of "abuse"... but I don't think they ever idle an engine for extended periods, or do those dyno tests with the engine two quarts low of 6 month old sludge in the oil pan. Heavy load testing is "sexy" but the real abuse happens at the low end of the scale and it is hard to test for that because you can't really condense five years of that kind of abuse into a couple weeks.

After working with a number of manufactures and at a number of proving grounds I can attest to this statement. Being that this site has a number of engine builders I would assume they have seen the same thing. Some people can break an anvil. I won't go into issues I have seen or how issues not seen during testing pop up just a few years down the road. Two racers can both start with identical engines and within months one will have a pile of rubble while the other walked away with the prize money.

That being said, I did not have the opportunity to do extensive long term testing on the Ecoboost vehicles, but the testing I did I was generally impressed. I did see one turbo failure and another we put holes in a full set of pistons, but that was in early testing a couple years before the vehicle and powerplant were coming out. As I say, buy what you want to buy, then maintain it like it is the last thing you will ever buy.

Paul

[Krooser]

Just talked to one of drivers who bought an EcoBoost last year. He is unimpressed with the fuel mileage but sez he has a lead foot. Said his last F150 got better mileage and he had to pay more for the Eco to get worse fuel economy.

My grandson has a 2.7... seems to be very happy with it. 2016 as I recall.

[gmc406]

As a self employed Ag mechanic I started out with a 97 Chevy half ton. After a few years the truck was miled out and tired of sitting on it’s a$$ from all my tools in it. It only had a 4.3L v-6 and it was time to upgrade. I wanted a 3/4 ton gas job to carry my heavy payload of tools. I certainly didn’t want a diesel, I wanted to keep it simple. I also didn’t want a service body either, I hate them and I liked the fact I could unload tools and use it a a personal vehicle if I wanted to.

I’m not racest towards any make, I just wanted a truck to suit my needs. I priced out both Chevy and Dodge trucks, the last stop was the Ford dealership. After a conversation with the salesman on what I needed a heavier truck for, he pushed me towards a new 2014 HD F150 with the eco boost.

I can say it was the best decision. The HD version F150 had the heavier suspension at 8200 gvw and 3.73 gears. Better yet I could get the eco boost. Currently loaded with tools the truck weighs 8150lbs and you wouldn’t know it. The bottom end torque of the engine is incredible. Passing people on the highway and not having to downshift is neat. A slight tip in, and the turbos spool up. The truck next to never drops a gear up any incline. Ford claims 400 ft/lbs by 1700rpm, and I believe it.

The eco boost has a torque curve much like a diesel. Ford has the engine shifting at 6000rpm, which is stupid. The engine is done making power at 5000rpm. I tell people I would never race a Chevy or a Dodge and expect to win. It has a different kind of power. No need to wind it up. I would, however, be willing to go head to head in the mountains with a trailer in toe.

As far as economy goes, I’m very happy as well. People need to understand these little engines. If you push it or drive aggressively, it will drink. The best thing you can do, is try not to spool the turbos. The turbos spool quickly and easily, especially in town. Once you learn how to drive it, you’ll be rewarded. The fact it doesn’t downshift hardly ever, helps as well. I drive the speed limit on the highway and 45 mph down gravel roads(to save tires and road rash). I get 12.2-12.8l/100km or 18-19 mpg(American gallon).

The second generation 3.5 is eaven better with 470ftl/lbs and an injection system that is both direct and port. This helps solve the problem with carbon buildup.

Oh ya, one more thing. You need to cool them down after driving just like a diesel.

[travis]

Gmc406, that is a very accurate description. I was surprised to see how low of rpms this thing runs at. At light throttle it stays in the 1200-1500 rpm range around town all the time. It also doesn’t kick down into a lower gear (or several lower) unless you really lay into the throttle. And it still pulls very strongly from 1200 rpms just lightly rolling into it. Like you said, it is very diesel like.

I rented a almost brand new 2015 F150 a while back, with the 360hp 5.0. It isn’t even comparable...that F150 really seemed weak until you got some rpms built up, then it pulled decently enough. You almost HAD to drive it aggressively just to keep up with traffic. I was impressed with 20mpg at 80mph for hours on end however.

We had looked at several late model Suburbans, but the 5.3’s felt completely gutless. The 6.2 Denalis run decently, but since they are more of a status symbol than anything (IMO, especially around here) they are way overpriced even with high miles.

My ‘99 C2500 suburban with the 5.7 Vortec isn’t even close to the ballpark as any of these. Hell...it ain’t even on the same planet.

[Steve.k]

Nothing wrong with 5.4 expedition. Wife had 3 last one sold with 280,000 km. Typically 20-25 mpg on highway and held the road perfect. All 5.4's zero cam phaser issues ever. She looked at new ones but didn't like the ecoboost at all. She opted for the 5.0 litre f150 crew.

[travis]

I have got to say I am truly impressed with the 3.5 EB. I towed for the first time with this thing last night...a 6 hour drive with the wife, 5 kids, our fat dog and towing approximately 4000-4200 pounds. Absolutely effortless running 75mph on the interstate, no problem passing slower traffic on the 2 lane back roads, and no problem staying with the stop and go city traffic without having to keep your foot buried in it. Probably the only thing I would change would be some heavier rear springs as I had a pretty heavy tongue weight, but other than that no complaints whatsoever.

Other than outright suspension beef, my 3/4 ton suburban has absolutely nothing on this Expedition.

[Casper393W]

I would steer clear of the Eco Boost....my buddy who works at a local Ford Dealership...told me that once they get up around 80k the turbos start leaking oil and the engines have timing change issues... He recommends to everyone buy a 5.0! I have never been impressed with the 3v engines but I do have a friend that has ran 5.20's in a 3600lb '09 mustang! They can make power!

[chilly460]

I can give a little insight. I had a 2004 F150 5.4 3v 2wd standard cab 3.73, towed 6200lbs combo of my Marauder and car trailer. Same car and trailer, I've also towed with my 2017 F150 Supercab 4x4 with the little 2.7L 3.55. It's not even close, the little 2.7L is just a far superior package, WAAYY more lowend, rarely ever have to pull it out of O/D and taking it down to 5th gear with the 3.55 gear hits right in the sweet spot. The Ecoboost is incredible, for what it is, up to 4000rpm, they will spin to 6000 but they're out of steam by 4500 or so. All lowend.

I owned an '09 Silverado 1500 in the interim, the Ecoboost is much better than that 5.3L combo as well.

I drove other new models before buying the 2017, the 6.2L Chevy combos are strong but still don't run as easily at 2000rpm as the Ecos, and the 5.3L don't have near the lowend.

My 2004 got 19mpg highway, 11mpg towing and always felt like you were flogging it. The 2017 does a legitimate 23mpg on highway unloaded, 12mpg towing.

[travis]

I averaged 14.9 going down there towing a car and trailer, 20.2 coming back without the car and trailer. And that was with the AC set on “kill”.

Btw...Houston was absolutely horrible. Same heat as north Texas, but with way, way more humidity. Even 78 degrees first thing in the morning was just nasty

[gmc406]

I would steer clear of the Eco Boost....my buddy who works at a local Ford Dealership...told me that once they get up around 80k the turbos start leaking oil and the engines have timing change issues... He recommends to everyone buy a 5.0! I have never been impressed with the 3v engines but I do have a friend that has ran 5.20's in a 3600lb '09 mustang! They can make power!

Ford addressed the problem for the 2015 model year.

GM never did address the 6.5 diesel injection pump issue back in the day nor the good ol 700r4/ 4L60E issues. Just thought I’d throw that out there

The second generation 3.5 eco boost would be a killer with 470ft/lbs. I bet most of that is available below 2500rpm.

[Walter R. Malik]

Cam indexing mechanisms and the actuating solenoids don't tolerate dirty or diluted oil for long ...
the 5.4L drives a whole lot better at "part-throttles"; especially when towing something. The closer you run toward Wide Open Throttle, the better the comparison gets toward the Eco-Boost.

[HDBD]

After dragging trailers heavily loaded across the country with various tow vehicles I would just say without exception the larger motor with more iron beats the smaller motor despite horsepower and torque specs. This story is more about durability at a duty cycle. In my case it was modified (light boost whipple 383) SBC VS nearly stock BBC in a similar 3500 chevy. The BBC was reliable, the SBC left me stranded with a few tow bills.

[PackardV8]

This story is more about durability at a duty cycle. In my case it was modified (light boost whipple 383) SBC VS nearly stock BBC in a similar 3500 chevy. The BBC was reliable, the SBC left me stranded with a few tow bills.

But is the above an apples comparision? You modified a light duty SBC and put it to towing heavy loads and compared it to a BBC operating within its design envelope. The Ford engines under discussion should all be operating within their OEM design envelope.

FWIW, I too was skeptical those tiny high-boost V6s could live, but Ford made and won the bet. Now, if owners will just change the oil.

[dfarr67]

I would steer clear of the Eco Boost....my buddy who works at a local Ford Dealership...told me that once they get up around 80k the turbos start leaking oil and the engines have timing change issues... He recommends to everyone buy a 5.0! I have never been impressed with the 3v engines but I do have a friend that has ran 5.20's in a 3600lb '09 mustang! They can make power!

Ford addressed the problem for the 2015 model year.

GM never did address the 6.5 diesel injection pump issue back in the day nor the good ol 700r4/ 4L60E issues. Just thought I’d throw that out there

The second generation 3.5 eco boost would be a killer with 470ft/lbs. I bet most of that is available below 2500rpm.

Ford had their diesel and OD issues as well.

[Walter R. Malik]

Cam indexing mechanisms and the actuating solenoids don't tolerate dirty or diluted oil for long ...
the 5.4L drives a whole lot better at "part-throttles"; especially when towing something. The closer you run toward Wide Open Throttle, the better the comparison gets toward the Eco-Boost.

That being said ... the 2015 Ford F150 with the 6.2 l gasoline "Raptor" engine is the best SMALL pick-up I have ever towed with.
Unfortunately, that combination is no longer available.