Frankshaft wrote: ↑Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:19 am
groberts101 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 24, 2018 9:40 am
Yeah.. most street rodders and entry level guys looking for dumbed down 9.7:1 crate motors usually are content with 90's tech and power levels. If that's the way you have me pegged then so be it but you couldn't be further from the truth because I cut, grind, modify, and weld most everything of my own. Hell, even my little lowly 302 mule motor is far beyond most guys race motor from a tech and modification standpoint. Cut manifolds, port welding, coatings, bigger lifters, handbuilt headers.. far from average and just how I do. Plus.. I can actually tune my junk to make things come together.
And regardless of decade being discussed.. the physics involved comparing duals to single remains a constant. Runner size and length changes will only tweak final results so much. All about carb signal dude.
Have you used one of the "new" carbs from one of the good carb guys? They are so much better than the "old" stuff its crazy. They truly work unbelievably well. Idle, throttle response, power, fuel usage, etc. They turn a 289-314 at .050 cam into something almost tame. Idle at 800 rpm for an hour if you wanted without loading up, coughing, bogging, flooding, etc. Absolutely INSTANT throttle response, that is literally better than efi. Like idling at 800 rpm, wack the throttle, it INSTANTLY is at 7000 rpm, and INSTANTLY idling again at 800 rpm. We are talking 2.4 to 2.8 inch throttle blades, with venturis sized to match, BIG. Keep in mind, a H.P. 1250 Holley dominator has a 2.08 throttle blade. The drivability is borderline amazing. On an intake that is big enough to drive a bus through. One of the 4150 versions are even better. They aren't cheap, but, they absolutely work. The right amount of fuel at the right time, makes up for A LOT. In a lot of cases, that is the issue.
I have one question for you Groberts, why a 302? Why not a 347 or a 363. And just tell everyone its a 302. Not to be a smartass, just curious.
I don't mess with big or really stout race type motors like you guys do, so all my stuff has been with typical cookie cut 750-850 cfm throttle bore/venturi sizing. Messed with a few older dommy's and couple 950's when tuning others rides but Holley's XP series is my personal favorite, which I typically like removing/correcting and race stepping the boosters. I currently have a cut horn/modded 1850 600cfm and 750DP I may use temporarily but will likely end up with a 650-750 Ultra converted to 50/50 mix or full E85 on this little motor. Since this is a dual plane setup(cut down/reflanged 351W air-gap) I may change over to a progressive linkage and run the 750DP. Only reason this motor stayed small CID is because, mainly I don't street race anymore, I got the used Eagle pendulum cut forged 3" crank for cheap and don't want to start breaking cheaper parts, stock block, 8" rear gears or otherwise. Longer 5.4" rod softens things up a bit too. Almost offset ground this crank and went with custom aluminum rods but decided to put the cash elsewhere, Innovators West belt drive and dampener that could be transferred over to my other bullet down the road. I like really light recip's no matter the power levels.. just my personal preference, is all. The car, 71 Mercury Comet GT(Ford Mavericks big nosed cousin) is pretty light too(sub-3k) so no need for 500+ horses at this stage of its build evolution. Several years from now when I cage it and build my fab 9" and add weight reduction I will turn up the wick. By then my two boys will likely be out on their own two feet and might even eventually grow a bigger pair and add twin turbo's.
But yeah, I do know what you mean about carb tuning because I've been cutting up, drilling, boring and converting 4150's and even lowly 1850's for many years now. Being a big compression ratio advocate, especially for E85 and even on pump gas, really helps push boundaries and EFI guys are sometimes stupified at how crisp the throttle response and tire reaction is to light throttle jabs. Some have even said seeing mine makes them want to keep tuning what they thought was good enough. lol I usually do well enough with my tunes to wet the manifolds plenum and they fire right up and idle without chokes. My last 383 Chebby's 750XP was sometimes driven without a choke during our MN winters and after about 15-20 seconds of throttle nursing would idle just fine on its own during warmup. And if the diisty's not locked out I also typically run buttloads of base timing, short mechanical sweeps, and modded vac advance pots. My last 2 motors have both had MSD programmable 6 and 7 series boxes with MAP's.. probably just run the 6 series unit on this lower budget deal and sell it off when I convert over to IR COP EFI on my bigger 342" all-aluminum Kaase headed SBF bullet.
I do agree with most that you guys have to offer around here but will never be a "bigger is better" convert when it comes to induction/plenum style/sizing for street type deals. Street/strip oriented type stuff.. sure, move the power band up.. give it some more gear and converter and deal with the compromises of one towards the other and let it eat. But not on part throttle/lower rpm/driver type deals which are often being talked about around here. Wack the throttle on those kinds of deals and the pressure differentials change far too suddenly for all those street oriented weights and gears to deal with. I do agree that a single plane can certainly help traction for tire limited cars and make them faster, and that in itself should be proof enough that single planes most definitely kill lower rpm torque enough to soften the tire hit, but I still almost always prefer to leverage today's suspension and tire tech rather than running a poor mans single plane style traction control. On my own personal rides.. I build as much power from idle to redline as I possible can and just learn how to work the pedal to make them ET the fastest.
I have a couple questions about my new Trick Flow 11R head 50 or maybe 52° seat mod's was hoping you could steer me in the right direction on and will PM you to avoid even more off-topic clutter around here. Not looking for gospel.. just some input gathering to know where I want to end up is all.