Newold1 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:03 pm
Intensity and passion getting a little to intense here to continue a constructive conversation. Understand that there are individuals on this forum who are professionals and heavily involved and employed in aspects of these conversations. Hence they are proud of their efforts, careers and organizations and attacking or bashing their fields or endeavors is unnecessary and counterproductive! STOP THAT SHIT!
Obviously it concerns many in the performance and racing fields whether actual participants, suppliers, vendors or just good old enthusiasts and viewers.
I think they are all concerned about the possible shrinkage and potential demise of performance racing of all types. As some have said and know certain forms of racing today like Nascar are also major entertainment venues for racing for their fans, viewers, teams, sponsors as well as the Television entities. In racing the best forms of racing entertainment tend to come from excitement and participation of both the racers, their teams, sponsors, the fans and viewership.
Nascar has been first and foremost made it's racing safer and as speeds and tighter racing became more common place they had to rightly make many changes and rules to improve safety of the fans trackside, the drivers and the support people. When rules go beyond that safety aspect they tend to sometimes go wayward and take some of the excitement and support for that racing. It's being seen in many racing venues and in Nascar it seems to be more prevalent and for many the opinion seems to be it's not doing one very big thing! Growing that Racing Sport for the primary incomes and support for that racing. IE: Fan and viewership growth, team growth, sponsorship growth and televised event growth !!
Bottom Line: If many of the technical changes and rules have not improved those areas OTHER THAN SAFETY, why make them??
Don't use massive crashes from pack racing that in fact has mostly been created by technical rules for parity that are actually worsening the problems!
Seems as though to much parity is actually counterproductive. JMHO
If you are addressing both - then that is fair
If you are only addressing me - then take a hike
Communists abound!
I rarely watch Nascar or any sports but I have to admit 30 two ton cars in extremely close formation sliding around at 190 MPH is very exciting to watch...cars spread out is boring unless you are a die hard fan or involved in the sport. Nascar has to make big money from TV, really big money, maybe more than ticket sale..... just like football...
What do the drivers say about all of this? How about the team owners? If it is this bad how come the racers don't tell Nascar to change or else? Maybe because it's all about money?
Motorcycle land speed racing... wearing animal hides and clinging to vibrating oily machines propelled by fire
tjs44 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 21, 2019 7:03 pm
1972HO,do you have any idea how much it would cost to do another engine for just 4 races a year?That had been looked at for years.I had dinner with Dale SNR 2 weeks before he died.He talked about smaller CI and said it was cost preventive to do such a thing for just 4 races.There is no getting out of trouble when you give the fans what they are asking for IMO.40 cars at 190 MPH 2 and 3 wide is going to create mayhem.Im really looking forward to the next few weeks to see what the new package does.Tom
Good race fan and car guy! ^^^^^^
I hate the new rules, but it could provide some great racing. Only time will tell!
tjs44 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 21, 2019 7:03 pm
1972HO,do you have any idea how much it would cost to do another engine for just 4 races a year?That had been looked at for years.I had dinner with Dale SNR 2 weeks before he died.He talked about smaller CI and said it was cost preventive to do such a thing for just 4 races.There is no getting out of trouble when you give the fans what they are asking for IMO.40 cars at 190 MPH 2 and 3 wide is going to create mayhem.Im really looking forward to the next few weeks to see what the new package does.Tom
Good race fan and car guy! ^^^^^^
I hate the new rules, but it could provide some great racing. Only time will tell!
Time will prove me correct. If you are a fan of crashing, then you'll lose two fans for every fan you may gain. You don't have to like my opinion, but who are you to tell anyone not to post? You're nobody special. You're opinion means nothing to me. You are just another guy caught in the weeds and can't see past the nose on your face. You have to protect the job you have by defending stupidity. I can't disrespect myself enough to do that for a job.
I, for one, am tired of the same, persistent dead horse that's beaten any time motorsports gets brought up.
"they don't look like showroom stock cars"
Nascar. Nhra. Someone even went as far as bringing F1 into the thread claiming they weren't like what we can buy. When was the last time F1 had cars you could buy in a showroom?
IMO, the top echelons of motorsports likely won't ever go back to stock-bodied cars. Personally, I'm convinced that if they did switch, I don't think it would make a difference to that many people. Except for maybe those that complain the loudest right now about not having OEM bodies.
Arthur wrote: ↑Thu Feb 21, 2019 4:13 pm
Nose ring too tight?
Your ego is hurting you
Awake Sir Warp!
Dude, you got issues!
When you even get a little bit of a clue what your talking about, I'd be more than happy to discuss it. Until then, your one of the biggest waists of bandwidth on this bored!
Not sure what you have against me, or probably just don't like me (join the club) but when it come to facts about the subject, your are clueless!
So just STFU!
And that goes for many here!
Not saying your stupid, but you really can't say shit unless you know the big picture. It is more than obvious, that some here I thought were knowledgable, have not got a clue!
Your logic is limited by your ego -
Enjoyed the to and fro
Cherio
When you say something is a waste of bandwidth, do you know what that means? Bandwidth is the maximum rate of data transfer across a given path. It's not the data that's transfered that's considered bandwidth. It's the speed at which that data transfers.
So saying someone is a waste of bandwidth actually doesn't even make sense in literal terms. You're saying they're a waste of rate of transfer. It'd just about make more sense to say they're a waste of data or something.
We often see people on Usenet talking about a post wasting bandwidth.
While the intended meaning is clear, the logic is backwards.
It is unused bandwidth that is wasted because we can not go back in
time and reclaim it. Using bandwidth up to the limits of channel
capacity would be optimizing the process.
I can see where one can be less than optimal in their use of bandwidth
in the sense that they are using more bits to convey a message than
required by information theory. But if the purpose of bandwidth is to
provide a means for communicaton, then we should communicate up to the
limits of the channel. And all that dark fiber out there tells me we
have a long ways to go before we hit the limits of available capacity.
There is and always has been a lot of thought and hard work put into NASCAR. Not all of it has worked out for the best, but that's the way things go with most things, not all changes work (ask any engine builder lol).
Personally my interest from a spectator perspective headed downhill in the late 80s when some changes were made that the drivers were against, but they had no say in the matter.
NASCAR still interests me from a technical perspective (engine), but watching NASCAR races has not been a thing for me for a long time. As far as oval track racing goes, interesting racing for me looks like this battle:
makin chips wrote: ↑Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:37 am
When you say something is a waste of bandwidth, do you know what that means? Bandwidth is the maximum rate of data transfer across a given path. It's not the data that's transfered that's considered bandwidth. It's the speed at which that data transfers.
So saying someone is a waste of bandwidth actually doesn't even make sense in literal terms. You're saying they're a waste of rate of transfer. It'd just about make more sense to say they're a waste of data or something.
We often see people on Usenet talking about a post wasting bandwidth.
While the intended meaning is clear, the logic is backwards.
It is unused bandwidth that is wasted because we can not go back in
time and reclaim it. Using bandwidth up to the limits of channel
capacity would be optimizing the process.
I can see where one can be less than optimal in their use of bandwidth
in the sense that they are using more bits to convey a message than
required by information theory. But if the purpose of bandwidth is to
provide a means for communicaton, then we should communicate up to the
limits of the channel. And all that dark fiber out there tells me we
have a long ways to go before we hit the limits of available capacity.
the importance of accuracy.... now you've just got to be an engineer
If more innovation were allowed, there might be more failures, but also many more interesting ideas being tested on the track.
Far too much attention has been given to the driver which is unfortunate. Racing is a team sport, not a star system.
I don't give a damn who is behind the wheel. I care about what is behind the team.
I’ve got 13 and 16 year old boys. If NASCAR doesn’t catch their generation soon who is going to be interested in the future. And their dad is a NASCSAR fan. They laugh when they see the cars going down the straight like a crab. Fuel injection? Welcome to the 21st century a decade or so late.
My oldest said they should control lap times with the tires. Going too fast at a certain track? Don’t take away HP or ridiculous aero packages. Give them 900HP and harder tires and let the driver drive the damn car.
David,do you actually know what you are talking about?Every friggin week last year cars and crews were getting busted for some kind of cheating!Call it innovative if you want but they were skirting the rules.Two crew chiefs were sent home today for not passing tech twice.They ARE a team!The crews on pit road MANY times get the car more spots then the driver does racing.I was at Fontana last year and watched as cars were sent back thru tech,watched them have to make changes to skirts,1/4 panels spoilers and splitters.Go to the races if you have anyway of getting hot passes as that is when you can see what is actually going on.9 car got busted last year for putting tape on the spoiler to get some Xtra down force.Got caught when someone noticed a crew member removing it after the race.4 car got busted with a illegal spoiler after the car was sent back to the R&D center.9 car gut busted for having a roof panel that would crush at speed to get more air on the spoiler. They spend stupid money in wind tunnels testing just to find that little Xtra here and there.Tom
