to much body rool on a metric factory stock any suggestions?
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mikie
to much body rool on a metric factory stock any suggestions?
hi i run a short track factory stock with very strict suspension rules cant use racing shocks same length springs all around no wedge bolts the cars got so much body roll off the corner sway bar is just about all the way down and thats the only way to make it better the problem is that the sway bar is pretty much my only adjustment on the car besides spring changes tire psi and stagger and ive tried all of them
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jeff swisher
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motormonkey
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1.Does the spring wire have to be OEM dimension? If not, go larger diameter wire.
2. If the wire has to be OEM diameter, there are higher tensile wires available, but probably will cost more than your entry level budget.
3. Any prohibition agains shortening the springs, as long as they are the same length? Shorter is a lot stiffer.
4. Do you have to use OEM shocks or is anything as long as it is not a racing shock OK? Go into the parts interchange books and look for a similar length and mounting from a truck.
thnx, jv.
2. If the wire has to be OEM diameter, there are higher tensile wires available, but probably will cost more than your entry level budget.
3. Any prohibition agains shortening the springs, as long as they are the same length? Shorter is a lot stiffer.
4. Do you have to use OEM shocks or is anything as long as it is not a racing shock OK? Go into the parts interchange books and look for a similar length and mounting from a truck.
thnx, jv.
Jack Vines
Studebaker-Packard V8 Limited
Obsolete Engineering
Studebaker-Packard V8 Limited
Obsolete Engineering
You have a problem when working on a car that the rules intend for you to keep the suspension stock. If everyone left it that way, it would be a fair race. We all know that's impossible for a racer. Your main problem is, you can't lower car with mandated spring heights and no pocket changes. If you could lower car that would put the center of gravity closer to the roll centers and help your problem some. Since you don't have a good way to lower car, can you lower any of the weight in the car? Even if it's a little here and there. Remove headliner and roof bracing, clean out dash or remove, lower gas tank, tilt radiator back and lower, drop engine a little, remove rear package tray, bracing in the trunk lid ect. you get the idea. It's a lot of work for small returns, but what you gonna do.
Next there is the roll bar. Get your tape measure and go to the junk yard. Look at station wagons even vans and trucks. Your looking for bigger diameter or shorter arms. Look for something close as far as width, you can always make a new frame mount and make it look like stock. While your there look for a variety of springs that are as long as yours or longer, bigger wire and smaller, you can cut to length. It's nice to have choices depending on what your car handles like if you get the roll out. I can tell you one thing for sure a stiffer roll bar will induce a push if all other things remain the same. To remove the push you will increase l/f and r/r spring rates and maybe soften r/f and l/r springs or a combination of some of them.
Before you start, take stock of what you have. Body roll in it's self isn't that bad other than it can give you an uneasy feeling. More important is do you have a push or lose condition in any part of the corner. Just look at a super dirt late model, they jack the left side up around 12 inches or more going threw a corner. They don't care how much it rolls as long as tires stay planted. The first thing I would look at, is are the right side springs bottoming out. I'll give you the most important piece of advise I ever got. Front to rear balance is the most important thing. Corner speed is king. The heavy end slides out. This means that anything that increases weight on contact patch will cause that end to slide out, Be it static weight or spring/ shock rate too heavy, or contact patch too small, it increases lbs per square inch it's heavier. That sounds too simple, but you will find that no matter what tricky suspensions you try it always holds true, dirt or pavement circle or road race. Yes there are other factors, but always hold that in the back of your mind when changing things around. That came from a man that had around 700 feature wins.
Next there is the roll bar. Get your tape measure and go to the junk yard. Look at station wagons even vans and trucks. Your looking for bigger diameter or shorter arms. Look for something close as far as width, you can always make a new frame mount and make it look like stock. While your there look for a variety of springs that are as long as yours or longer, bigger wire and smaller, you can cut to length. It's nice to have choices depending on what your car handles like if you get the roll out. I can tell you one thing for sure a stiffer roll bar will induce a push if all other things remain the same. To remove the push you will increase l/f and r/r spring rates and maybe soften r/f and l/r springs or a combination of some of them.
Before you start, take stock of what you have. Body roll in it's self isn't that bad other than it can give you an uneasy feeling. More important is do you have a push or lose condition in any part of the corner. Just look at a super dirt late model, they jack the left side up around 12 inches or more going threw a corner. They don't care how much it rolls as long as tires stay planted. The first thing I would look at, is are the right side springs bottoming out. I'll give you the most important piece of advise I ever got. Front to rear balance is the most important thing. Corner speed is king. The heavy end slides out. This means that anything that increases weight on contact patch will cause that end to slide out, Be it static weight or spring/ shock rate too heavy, or contact patch too small, it increases lbs per square inch it's heavier. That sounds too simple, but you will find that no matter what tricky suspensions you try it always holds true, dirt or pavement circle or road race. Yes there are other factors, but always hold that in the back of your mind when changing things around. That came from a man that had around 700 feature wins.
Older I get the less I know for sure
S 10 trucks and Z28 Camaro springs are considerably stiffer than stock and will help as well.
Maliburacing.com had a great tech area that had a listing of all the MOOG replacement springs, their rates and what they came from. Very helpful.
I used a 1 1/4" sway bar on my Cutlass with good results. Remember to replace the stock left side link kit with a length of threaded rod and some flat washers and nuts so you can tune it a bit...
This was for a 1/4 mile paved track....
RR
Maliburacing.com had a great tech area that had a listing of all the MOOG replacement springs, their rates and what they came from. Very helpful.
I used a 1 1/4" sway bar on my Cutlass with good results. Remember to replace the stock left side link kit with a length of threaded rod and some flat washers and nuts so you can tune it a bit...
This was for a 1/4 mile paved track....
RR